Page 4


money I could raise if I was a potential governor and I could appoint all these ambassadors or name the Texas Air Force commander in chief? . . . This fella said the other day, “You know, Colorado could be the Switzerland. They could be neutral. They could let Wyoming go to war.” Why stop it just with these programs, let’s go ahead with defense Texas might have the best postal system of all the other states. . . . What’s happened on land use planning and your coastal management programs? an idea whose time has come and passed. Most of the land-use decisions are now made by the air-quality federal regulators. . . . People have become a little more sensible about general landuse considerations. . . . For example, you don’t knowingly put feed lots on top of aquifer recharge areas any more. . . The coastal program was purely a product of a lot of hard work and a governor that just refused to accept it and send it forward. That’s right, and subsequently Clements. . . . But it was not an exercise that was idle. We have much better coordination between the agencies as a result of that program. We have a lot better .. . Former U.S. Senator Ralph Yarborough is all-out for Bob Armstrong for governor. J. R. Parten, the wealthy former UT regents’ chairman and Democratic national committeeman, is also supporting the land commissioner. Former Houston Mayor Fred Hofheinz is raising money for Armstrong in Houston. Buddy Temple’s campaign occupies the office space prevously used by Sen. Peyton McKnight, Tyler, who spent $1.8 million before dropping out. Ex-Rep. Luther Jones, El Paso, and John Rogers, the labor-connected PR consultant, are prominent in Temple’s campaign. Mark White’s director, Dwayne Holman, said the White campaign anticipates spending $1.5 to $2 million by May 1. White’s staff numbers 23. Temple’s is still expanding; Armstrong has six, plus “senior volunteer” Walter Richter, the former state senator and REA staffer. Clements has raised $3 million and has said he will spend as much as necessary to get reelected. Since he spent $7 million the first time, guesses run to $10 million and a total cost for all gubernatorial candidates of as much as twice that, $20 million. studies of what is there. We have . . . the best public participation program in government. . . . People that want to site major facilities come and look at where they can do it in the most environmentally sensible way. . . . A lot of things have happened. U.S. Steel, for example, has built a tremendous plant back off of the bay margins, as we call ’em. You do an inland canal back in there. Inland canals are very environmentally sound because you just have your canal into your plant. Contrast that, for example, with Armco, who built theirs right on the bayou itself. Now when Armco built it we were at war .. . nobody was thinkin’ about what happened to the salt marsh, but I’m just sayin’ we do a much better job of facility siting as a result of that program. . . . If the job is to beat Bill Clements, we have a better chance of beating him with somebody who has a clear track record in the executive branch as well as in the legislative branch. . . . Consequently, you can look at what’s happened in this agency, and I just frankly do not feel that either Mark or Buddy have had the length or breadth or recency of experience in dealing with things as broad and general as the coastal management program. . . . Our energy efficiency work is something that we haven’t talked about I’m very pleased about. We had an energy efficiency subcommittee of TENRAC that is hopefully going to have some real end. . . . Nuclear Power Out I meant to ask you about solar power, nuclear power, coal burning, strip mining. . . . We can do a lot of things about solar if we would do it. I would like to see us have more emphasis into the solar area. I am convinced that nuclear power is failing not because of a number of reasons why it should fail in terms of danger or the nuke issue generally, but it fails because it doesn’t work. It is not sound in any way that I have seen financially. Unitl I can see that happen, I would not like to see us start any more nuclear power facilities til somebody can show me that it’s not only workable but safe. It’s just been a tragedy’s too strong a word, but the whole South Texas \(Nucrous. What would you have the state do in solar that it hasn’t? I think we need to pay more attention to research. I think you need to sell the public on the fact that many solar simple solutions do work, the way you turn your house, the way your streets run. We’ve looked at some of that. Good builders still do this sometime. I have a neighbor who has a 5200-square-foot house at Georgetown and their bills have never exceeded $40 a month, and they are massively into solar and available wind and that sort of thing. Amazing. Oh, yeah, but it’s just dynamite. Would you put the state actively on the side of that kind of a And an education process to show people how you can do it. Plus all of the low-income weather-stripping programs are good, winterization as well as double-glass, all those things people need to know about. Now Clements’ idea is all this oughta come outa the private sector and the free enterprise system will take care of it. I think you can nudge people, and teach people, and then the free enterprise system comes along you’re not competing with them, you just educate people about what they can gain by doing things this way. White, Temple Now you vis-a-vis Mark White: would you talk about Mark White? Why should one vote for you instead of White? He’s the attorney general, a lot of Democrats appear to be settling for him. What’s the difference? apart from experience which you’ve discussed. Well, look at his record as attorney general. Well what do you think about his record? I think that, uh, [a rather long silence]: I don’t know how tough I want to be this early. I’d almost say, ask anyone who has worked for him, ask anyone who he has represented, and I’ll sort of ride on their judgment. You made a very tough conflict of interest charge against Temple.t It’s not against Temple, it’s against the structure that he finds himself in. . . . You have the same conflict until your term ends. That’s true. But it’s double-tough because he is a regulator. We are a proprietary agency. But I’m just talkin’ about the whole tradition of things, you have to have new officeholders, and you shouldn’t say that anybody that’s in office can’t run, but it’s this idea of five years left in a term of a regulator on an agency which is probably uniformly considered to be the most powerful agency in the state. Just suppose you were Joe Oil and Gas Man, and somebody on behalf of Buddy not Buddy comes to you and says, 12 FEBRUARY 26, 1982